Former Secretary of Protection Chuck Hagel (proven right here at NATO headquarters in Brussels in 2015) explains the challenges that President-elect Trump’s choose to guide the Division of Protection will inherit.
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Former Secretary of Protection Chuck Hagel (proven right here at NATO headquarters in Brussels in 2015) explains the challenges that President-elect Trump’s choose to guide the Division of Protection will inherit.
Virginia Mayo/AP
What does it take to run the Division of Protection?
It is without doubt one of the largest, most complicated entities within the U.S. authorities.
There are greater than 3 million workers, together with civilians and navy service members. Former Protection Secretary Chuck Hagel said the division has its personal judicial code, authorized system and healthcare system.
Hagel, who was in cost from 2013 to 2015, informed All Issues Thought of host Mary Louise Kelly that it’s the “largest establishment on this planet.”
Hagel joined this system to clarify the challenges President-elect Donald Trump’s nominee, Pete Hegseth, would possibly inherit.
If confirmed, Hegseth can be the least skilled protection secretary in American historical past.
This interview has been evenly edited for size and readability.
Interview highlights
Mary Louise Kelly: President-elect Trump’s choose to guide the Pentagon is Pete Hegseth. He’s a Fox Information host. He is a veteran of the Military Nationwide Guard. He has by no means run a giant group. NPR Pentagon correspondent Tom Bowman reviewed the biographies of protection secretaries and secretaries of conflict. He says, “Surely, Hegseth has the least expertise.” What questions does that elevate?
Chuck Hagel: I believe that is a matter, and I believe the Senate affirmation course of will convey that up. The affirmation course of of those massive jobs is so critically vital. I believe, although, it is extra than simply expertise. It is the entire persona of all who you might be and what you convey to the job.
Kelly: You wrote an opinion essay for The New York Occasions titled, “Why I’m Worried About Our Military.” You write, “Political independence and ethics are the bedrock of our navy at the moment. I am involved that each are in peril.” Secretary Hagel, why?
Hagel: If the navy is ever politicized in any approach – and we’re seeing some indications from this incoming administration that it could be. For instance, the “Warriors” group – a gaggle that President-elect Trump has talked about evaluating generals and admirals, making selections about whether or not these individuals are certified to guide the navy or not, or in the event that they’ve made errors after which recommending to the president that he fireplace them – that is politicizing the navy. And the issues that Mr. Hegseth stated concerning the navy – that does concern me in each approach.
Kelly: Might I ask what remarks are supplying you with pause?
Hagel: Sure. For instance, ladies shouldn’t be in fight. , we handed that marker a very long time in the past, this subject of variety within the navy.
A 2016 file picture of Secretary of Protection nominee Pete Hegseth. If confirmed, Hegseth can be the least skilled protection secretary in American historical past.
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Kelly: Simply to place some extent on this, Trump’s nominee, Pete Hegseth, has steered he would look to take away senior officers that he sees as “too woke.” He has included the present chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Workers in that. My query to you: Can he do this?
Hagel: Effectively, the president of the US has the authority to fireplace any federal worker. He can do this. Whenever you begin speaking about firing the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Workers, whose report is as spectacular as any report we have seen – while you speak about firing him due to so-called “woke” – what do you imply by that? That is what’s so harmful right here, and that is why I am so involved. If, in reality, this administration follows by way of on these items, then we’re in for lots of hassle.
Kelly: What while you say we could possibly be in for lots of hassle? What does that imply?
Hagel: Officers resigning. Whenever you begin firing individuals from the skin, you will have officers and senior enlisted resign. You’ll lose the standard of the individuals who now serve. Our adversaries will see that. Our allies will see that. They are going to take from {that a} weakening of our navy, a weakening of our navy management, a weakening of our dedication by our navy to a goal a lot bigger than their very own self-interest. And that is the US of America’s safety.
Karen Zamora tailored this interview for the online.
MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
What does it take to run the Division of Protection? That could be a query that’ll be on the coronary heart of Pete Hegseth’s affirmation course of early subsequent 12 months. Hegseth, longtime Fox Information host, is President-elect Trump’s nominee for secretary of protection. The Division he is nominated to run is without doubt one of the greatest, most complicated entities within the U.S. – an establishment that, as our subsequent visitor notes, has its personal judicial code, its personal authorized system, its well being care system.
Effectively, Chuck Hagel ran that establishment. He served as secretary of protection from 2013 to 2015. Earlier than that, he served a dozen years within the U.S. Senate as a Republican senator from Nebraska. Secretary Hagel, nice to talk with you once more.
CHUCK HAGEL: Oh, thanks.
KELLY: I need to begin by letting you give us some sense of the span of issues that may cross your desk as you tried to run it – the Protection Division.
HAGEL: Effectively, the best way I clarify that job – I led it. I did not run it. I led it. And I believe that is vital as a result of you must work with and hearken to so many alternative leaders inside the establishment – I imply, beginning with the chairman of the joint chiefs of workers after which every of the chiefs of the companies. You have received the White Home. You’re employed with all of the establishments in authorities. It is a day by day, early-in-the-morning-to-late-at-night effort. Sudden – numerous sudden issues come throughout your desk. You are all over the world. , I believe within the two years I used to be secretary, I took round 27 worldwide journeys.
KELLY: Truthful to say you aren’t describing an entry-level administration job.
HAGEL: (Laughter) No. However, you understand, these of us who had the privilege of main the Pentagon had by no means had an expertise fairly like that, and actually no person has. However most of us who’ve led it have had some expertise main establishments in authorities and within the personal sector.
KELLY: So I do need to flip you to the present second and to President-elect Trump’s choose to guide the Pentagon. He’s a Fox Information host. He is an Military veteran, Nationwide Guard. He has by no means run a giant group. Our Pentagon correspondent, Tom Bowman, who’s lined the Protection Division for a few years, went again over the biographies of protection secretaries and secretaries of conflict, going again to the start of the Republic. He says, and I am quoting, “indubitably, Hegseth has the least expertise.” What questions does that elevate?
HAGEL: I believe that is a matter, and I believe the Senate affirmation course of will convey that up. I imply, the affirmation course of of those massive jobs is so critically vital. I believe, although, it is extra than simply expertise. I imply, it is the entire persona of who you might be and what you convey to the job.
KELLY: So that you wrote an essay for The New York Occasions final week, and the headline was, “Why I am Fearful About Our Navy.” You write…
(Studying) Political independence and ethics are the bedrock of our navy. At present, I am involved that each are in peril.
Secretary Hagel, why?
HAGEL: If the navy is ever politicized in any approach – and we’re seeing some indications from this incoming administration that it could be – for instance, the soldiers group – this group that President-elect Trump has talked about – evaluating generals and admirals, making selections whether or not these individuals are certified to guide the navy or not or in the event that they’ve made errors after which recommending to the president that he fireplace them – that is politicizing the navy. And the issues that Mr. Hegseth’s stated concerning the navy, that does concern me in each approach as a result of, in the event you politicize the navy, you politicize…
KELLY: Might I ask what remarks are supplying you with pause?
HAGEL: Sure. For instance, ladies shouldn’t be in fight. , we handed that marker a very long time in the past – this subject of variety within the navy.
KELLY: Simply to place some extent on this, Trump’s nominee, he has steered he would look to take away senior officers that he sees as too woke. He has included the present chairman of the joint chiefs in that. My query to you – can he do this? I imply, only for individuals who do not comply with this intently, the chairman of the joint chiefs serves a four-year time period. The present chair, CQ Brown, is just one 12 months in.
HAGEL: Sure. Effectively, the president of the US has the authority to fireplace any federal worker. He can do this. And that is one other instance of what I am speaking about. Whenever you begin speaking about, properly, firing the chairman of the joint chiefs of workers, whose report is as spectacular as any report we have seen – while you speak about firing him due to so-called woke, what do you imply by that? That is what’s so harmful right here, and that is why I am so involved. If, in reality, this administration follows by way of on these items, then we’re in for lots of hassle.
KELLY: What – while you say we could possibly be in for lots of hassle – hassle like what? What does that imply?
HAGEL: Oh, officers resigning – while you begin firing individuals from the skin, you will have officers and senior enlisted resign. You’ll lose the standard of the individuals who now serve. Our adversaries will see that. Our allies will see that. They are going to take from {that a} weakening of our navy, a weakening of our navy management, a weakening of our dedication by our navy to a goal a lot bigger than their very own self-interest – and that is the US of America’s safety.
KELLY: To individuals who would possibly have a look at the Protection Division and say, hey, possibly this establishment is due for a shake-up – it is a navy that fought two lengthy, actually costly wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, as I need not let you know, the place aims weren’t at all times clearly outlined.
HAGEL: Effectively, that does not come from the navy. That comes from the political management of our nation. It wasn’t the navy. Our navy serves the president because the chief and commander in chief of this nation, with the acquiescence and the help of the Congress and the American individuals. However the navy does not make that call.
KELLY: Former Protection Secretary and former Republican Senator Chuck Hagel. Secretary, thanks.
HAGEL: Thanks very a lot.
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